Re: The General Tolkien News Thread

[Mrs Figg]

got to say Ravenna seems an odd choice. its by the sea and its very flat with no mountains. There are many places that look the part more.

[Bluebottle]

Perhaps he was thinking architecture wise.

[Mrs Figg]

could be.

[Mrs Figg]

I am digging a more mittel European look for minas tirith personally.



[URL=https://s1247.photobucket.com/user/cat402/media/3ffd582e-0586-418e-b48e-5ba0394b283c_zpsat9tpxmi.jpg.html]

[halfwise]

I though Mount St Michel was the inspiration for Minas Tirith.

[malickfan]

Update on the Warner Bros/Tolkien Estate lawsuit:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr-esq/warner-bros-can-sue-tolkien-835296



I don't see this winding up anytime soon..

[Pettytyrant101]

Just another reason to wish these films had never fucking happened

[Eldorion]

Seeing as the original agreements have not been made public I don't think any of us can form an informed opinion about who is in the right here, legally speaking.

[malickfan]

Seeing as the original agreements have not been made public I don't think any of us can form an informed opinion about who is in the right here, legally speaking.

That is a fair point, but I find it kinda ironic WB are after more money considering they were rather lax with marketing TH films in comparison to New Line, I don't recall seeing any trailers for BOTFA (other than on youtube) and you only have to look at TORn to see how dissapointed people are with the EE.

[Eldorion]

I mean, it wasn't like Star Wars or Minions level marketing, to pick two recent examples, butI don't know exactly what people were expecting.  I guess since I was too young to really be paying attention to the LOTR stuff when those films were coming out I don't have much of a frame of reference for New Line's marketing. I do think there was more surrounding AUJ, so I wonder if WB backed off after the below-expectations box office returns for the first film.

The EE theatrical release was pretty poorly marketed, but that was really just for the hardcore fans anyway.

[Bluebottle]

Seeing as the original agreements have not been made public I don't think any of us can form an informed opinion about who is in the right here, legally speaking.

Well, that is true of course. Although, one can of course speculate.

For instance, let's say the original contract where Tolkien signed away the movie rights only expressly mentions tangible merchandize. Normal contractual principles would say that the obligations between the contracting parties begins and ends with the contract. Particularly when it delves into depth and is very technical, hinting that the contracting parties has put what they saw as the entirety of their relationship in the regard of what the contract handled into the contract. I am struggling to see good arguments that would entail an intellectual property right holder, remember Tolkien sold the rights himself, the originating artist, would have signed away more of his intellectual property than the agreement he made said. That goes against my immediate sense of justice, at least.

Now let's say there were such arguments anyway, what would they be. Well, it could be said for one that the standard in these contractual relationships today is that both tangible and intangible rights are sold when a deal selling movie rights to popular novels are made. If this is standard practice, that could be something that counts for these rights also being included in the agreement, even if they were not mentioned in the actual contract. It might also be argued that the only reason intangible merchandize was not mentioned in the agreement was that it wasn't a viable option for either of the parties to consider at the time of the agreement. Intangible merchandize at that time not really being a thing. That there has come this whole new industry into being, with computer games, and online games and so on does in my opinion count for the view that this is something that needs to expressly agreed between the parties. Taking into account the wide ranging consequences it has, both economically and practically.

In the end what might be of the most importance is what was the understanding between the contracting parties at the signing of the contract. If the issue of intangible merchandize was an issue, and left out for a reason, I don't see Warner Brothers having much of a case in any.. case.

All of this relies on how the Tolkien estate has argued the case publicly being the actual case though.

[malickfan]

Remember that attempt to crowd fund the construction of a real life Minas Tirith a few months ago...well they weren't successful

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/campaign-finished--2#/story

New book:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Secret-Vice-J-R-Tolkien/dp/0008131392

[Mrs Figg]

I don't bother packing my mithril boots then.

[Eldorion]

New book:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Secret-Vice-J-R-Tolkien/dp/0008131392

I wonder if the book really mentions ASOIAF/GOT as much as the blurb implies or if it's merely as transparent a bid for pop cultural relevance by the publisher as it appears to be.

[malickfan]

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/75986534/health-and-safety-legislation-sees-peter-jackson-resign-as-weta-workshop-director

I'd assume Jackson didn't have a great deal of involvement in the day to day workings of the company anyway, and it is probably unlikely to effect Weta's involvement in any future projects of his, interesting to see that Jamie Selkirk (editor of ROTK and most of Jackson's pre-tolkien work, IIRC also an associate producer on LOTR) was still involved with the company as I don't think he worked on T.H.

Jackson has mentioned in previous interviews that he'd be interested in making a WW1 film exploring the Gallipoli Landings...I wonder if the photography was a hint or jokey reference?

[halfwise]

Makes sense. I never thought he was a managing director of Weta to begin with.

[malickfan]

Two previously unknown Tolkien poems discovered:

http://www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/14278587.Undiscovered_J_R_R_Tolkien_poems_found_in_1936_school_magazine/

http://www.olab.org.uk/media/news/article/6775/Tolkien-poems-in-school-annual

[azriel]

Lucky find wonder if there's anything else lurking secretly thats yet to be discovered ?

[malickfan]

First ever critical study of Tolkien’s little-known essay, which reveals how language invention shaped the creation of Middle-earth and beyond, to George R R Martin’s Game of Thrones.

J.R.R. Tolkien’s linguistic invention was a fundamental part of his artistic output, to the extent that later on in life he attributed the existence of his mythology to the desire to give his languages a home and peoples to speak them. As Tolkien puts it in ‘A Secret Vice’, ‘the making of language and mythology are related functions’’.

In the 1930s, Tolkien composed and delivered two lectures, in which he explored these two key elements of his sub-creative methodology. The second of these, the seminal Andrew Lang Lecture for 1938–9, ‘On Fairy-Stories’, which he delivered at the University of St Andrews in Scotland, is well known. But many years before, in 1931, Tolkien gave a talk to a literary society entitled ‘A Hobby for the Home’, where he unveiled for the first time to a listening public the art that he had both himself encountered and been involved with since his earliest childhood: ‘the construction of imaginary languages in full or outline for amusement’.

This talk would be edited by Christopher Tolkien for inclusion as ‘A Secret Vice’ in The Monsters and the Critics and Other Essays and serves as the principal exposition of Tolkien’s art of inventing languages. This new critical edition, which includes previously unpublished notes and drafts by Tolkien connected with the essay, including his ‘Essay on Phonetic Symbolism’, goes some way towards re-opening the debate on the importance of linguistic invention in Tolkien’s mythology and the role of imaginary languages in fantasy literature.

Hardcover: 300 pages
Publisher: HarperCollins (7 April 2016)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Secret-Vice-J-R-Tolkien/dp/0008131392

[David H]

[azriel]

'ere ? have we been taken over ?

[chris63]

I though Mount St Michel was the inspiration for Minas Tirith.

Been there. Lovely place.

[halfwise]

I'm jealous.

[azriel]

That place is SO Minas Tirith there's no denying it

[malickfan]

https://atolkienistperspective.wordpress.com/2016/03/31/breaking-a-tale-of-the-north-new-middle-earth-film/#more-5908

Given there's no source cited I'd assume this is an early April Fools joke (though I was told on TORn a few months ago, that one of the admins had reported at a convention there were 'plans in place' for the future of the franchise) so there's no need to get angry just yet Petty...

...though given the mixed reception to the DC universe films, Mad Max 5 stalling in pre-production and the gamble of Fanastic Beasts, I don't doubt that WB aren't quite finished with the franchise...